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discerningkate December 10, 2012

High Ranking US Major General Exposes September 11

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39Comments

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  1. 1
    oswald on December 10, 2012 at 1:51 am
    Reply

    Hello Kate,

    The most important aspect about 911 is to realize that concurrent with the “event” there was unleashed the largest disinfo campaign in history. Whereas other hoaxes from the past can be easily pierced because they pre-date the internet and therefore rely on outmoded disinfo techniques, the 911 disinfo campaign is in a class by itself.

    We are ruled by an elite comprising of graduates of the Broadmoor academy while run by Jimmy Savile with Peter Sutcliffe giving the final exam. Think Tavistock on steroids. This psychopath elite’s genocidial NWO seeks as it’s final goal the destruction of all national sovereignty and it’s next intended victim is the American Republic.

    The closest the elite has come to exposing what happened on 911 is Khalezov. It must be understood that the elite has to be careful not to alienate it’s useful idiots by going too far, at least, not until the final moment when it has complete success (WWIII thermonuclear holocaust) in the bag. When the usefull idiots are being vaporized the elite will be far away from retribution in carefully prepared doomsteads scattered throughout the globe.

    Thus, so as not to alienate the useful idiots, 911 was carried out as a complete hoax with no immediate deaths. The only deaths are first responders who are contracting various cancers as a result of chronic radiation exposure effects. These cancers have just recently been covered by the 911 Health Bill which itself was quietly enacted and signed into law.

    In summary, no planes, no hijackers, hollow twin towers, no jumpers,no Pentagon plane/missile, no deaths.

    In actuality, hollow twin towers with just a few interior floors and no actual tenants beyond an observation deck in one tower and a restaurant in the other built as a Reichstag fire prop, faked inserted plane footage, special effects show up top and 150kt nuclear fusion detonation underground and lots of actors.

    Welcome to the Matrix!

    • 2
      Frank on January 20, 2013 at 11:24 am
      Reply

      So damn elated that people are STARTING to realize this and FINALLY are beginning to “wrap their heads around it” and to what extent it goes, and in a lot of cases has already been proven to be FACT.

    • 3
      Pat Uskert on March 1, 2013 at 11:10 pm
      Reply

      Kate, thank you for this very important interview.

    • 4
      authorthat on July 4, 2013 at 7:25 am
      Reply

      ACTORS ? I am a veteran of ten years military service in mobile infantry, artillary, special service force, and military intelligence. Some of my training includes photographic interpretation, obviously practiced in visual recognition as all are in that job. I have been to Tromso Norway, and I have been underground. Impressive. Obviously Maj Gen Stubblebine has his dots connected, but he is protecting himself to a point, because he does not say what he believes, proof or not.
      HERE IS TRUTH.
      The pentagon was hit by a cruise missile.Period. It was pulled just like the twin towers were but with a difference.The govt ops E-10 military aircraft were covered, prepared and refurbished at fort Collins Colorado. Technicians placed global hawk guidance systems into them and flown into the towers by remote control. I am also qualified for a similar roll, using a computerized fly by wire system for flying missiles into targets. More to follow.

      • 5
        authorthat on July 4, 2013 at 7:33 am

        As the precisely timed explosions went off, anyone on that floor was instantly killed floor by floor. The explosives are only made in one place in Israel, and stored on a single US base. This material is not available anywhere else. They used superthermite high explosives with nutron insertion. Anything containing water immediately vapourized into dust. ANYTHING paramagnetic…was instantly turned into dust…including all the people, The only ACTORS in this were of the new world disorder like the Bush family.

    • 6
      discerningkate on December 20, 2013 at 10:22 pm
      Reply

      How is that even possible? I can’t fathom it….

  2. 7
    discerningkate on December 10, 2012 at 3:46 am
    Reply

    You’re saying it didn’t really happen? I don’t understand. No one died in the twin towers? How is that possible?

  3. 8
    oswald on December 10, 2012 at 5:32 am
    Reply

    Take the red pill…

  4. 9
    Loohan on December 12, 2012 at 5:30 am
    Reply

    Hehe, Oswald, you definitely do have the correct concept, but i believe you are mistaken in this instance.
    I can’t PROVE anything, but as a psychic, i know that there were NO deaths (and probably no injuries) in the Norwegian “massacre”. NO deaths (and probably no injuries) in the Batman “shooting”, and only one person shot in the Gabby Giffords event (Judge Roll was assassinated).
    However, it is my impression that thousands DID get killed in the towers, including many shapeshifting satanists.

  5. 10
    oswald on December 16, 2012 at 12:13 am
    Reply

    Well Loohan, there are many, many rabbits to chase down various rabbit holes. One must be careful to not be like a young shark who fails to catch a single fish because of being distracted by the entire school.

    For the uninitiated, the important first step is to reach an understanding of the modus opperandi of the criminal global elite pulling the strings. After that, it becomes easy to pick apart their individual crimes using the usual crime solving techniques of means, motive and opportunity.

    The interesting aspect of 911 is the hoax is past it’s expiration date. The original intent was to have the American Republic embroiled in an “Eastern Front” campaign in Iraq with a long supply chain through the Persian Gulf and a second “Dunkirk” at Basra.

    Didn’t happen. Now the criminal global elite has to contend with explaining the chronic radiation poisoning and resultant cancers of the first responders at “Ground Zero”,due to inhalation of radioactive dust/vapors from the underground nuclear explosions, to it’s cadre of useful idiots.

    Like trapped rats, the criminal global elite of Satan Worshiping Pedophiles is desperate and therefore at it’s most dangerous. It behooves the national patriot movement to maintain calm, cool collected heads while steadily applying pressure. The recent school shooting in Connecticut is an example of the criminal elite’s desperation as they yet again play the Columbine – Virginia Tech card in it’s ongoing campaign to disarm the American popularis.

    BTW, which shape shifting satanists are you alluding to? Perhaps the colony found on the moon by the Apollo rover which fell into one of their sublunar caverns :)?

  6. 11
    Loohan on December 16, 2012 at 9:50 am
    Reply

    Like i said, i can’t prove anything, but i know what i know. Almost all of these pedophile satanists are shapeshifting repts. And only about 30% of evil shapeshifting repts on Earth are into blood ritual (a practice that has grave disdvantages as well as advantages for the tyrant).
    In the recent CT shooting, the non-satanist shapeshifting principal actually was sacrificed, i believe. (And all the cops in the pics are shapeshifters.) Yet, i’m pretty sure (pending seeing an actual list or pics) that all the others killed (and i believe they were killed this time) were not shapeshifters.
    It is not uncommon for them to sacrifice their own, e.g. Oscar Romero, Enrique Alvarez Córdova, Martin Luther King… at least i doubt these were instances of infighting.

  7. 12
    oswald on December 17, 2012 at 5:31 am
    Reply

    The important thing in doing battle with disinfo agents is to maintain one’s psychological balance. Recognize their various and sundry techniques. One such technique is to first mix reality with disinfo to gain credibility and then veer off on a completely absurd tangent.

    One has to be patient, reel them in and steadily apply pressure by focusing on those aspects of the hoax which can be easily verified and which as a result the disinfo agent will always steer away from.

    So Loohan, do you believe any planes were actually hijacked on 911? Do you believe there were any plane impacts on 911?

    Thanks in advance for your response.

    • 13
      loohan7 on December 17, 2012 at 11:31 am
      Reply

      Well, that is a good one. I didn’t really start develop my abilities much until 2005, and by that time the trail was pretty muddy. And i haven’t really prioritized attempting to figure out which theory of how it was done is correct. I can tell you that almost all prominent 9/11 “truthers” that have websites are CIAlizards. And it is typical of CIA agents and the like to pretend to disagree with each other.
      But there is the occasional honest-seeming Earthling out there, too. I could give you an example or 2 of the latter, but i have not really studied their material yet, as i am a practical person deeply involved in doing a lot of present-time things that matter.
      Which is not to imply that the details of that crime don’t matter, just that for my role in things, it is not of importance at this time.
      Of course i do not believe a plane hit the Pentagon; partly because a gov’t satanist relative of mine said he watched it come in and crash into the Pentagon with his own eyes.
      And of course i do not believe that any objects that did or did not crash into the towers were responsible for much of the destruction.
      And i really don’t give a f*** what you think of me. I know you are a well-intentioned individual, slightly ignorant some ways, but not stupid. So you are OK with me and it is OK with me if we end this conversation anytime.

  8. 14
    loohan7 on December 18, 2012 at 9:47 am
    Reply

    On second thought, you did pique my interest. I realized i had never really gone over the Flight 93 alleged passengers, etc..
    They are depicted and named here:
    http://www.honorflight93.org/presskit/passengers.html
    The odd thing is, they all feel fake to me. Like they never existed, and neither did their families.
    The flight 11 people
    http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/2001/09/12/victim-capsule-flight11.htm
    were real. So were the ones in 175 and 77. In fact, many were shapeshifters/satanists, as is the norm for plane passengers, let alone crew.
    The “confirmed dead at Pentagon” list
    http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/2001/09/20/pentagon-dead.htm
    feels like fiction. Yet oddly, the Partial list of missing persons in the Pentagon
    http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/2001/09/13/victims-pentagon.htm
    feels like all were real people who are now dead.

    How about the Official list of the victims of the World Trade Center attack:
    http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/sept11/2003-09-09-wtc-official-list_x.htm
    Now this is intriguing. Some of them never existed, most of them are dead, and some are still alive! First llive one listed is this guy Andrew Anthony Abate, whose pics are up on google. Shapeshifter; think he’s living out west now under new identity.

    Unfortunately i can’t discern when, where, how the dead people died.

  9. 15
    loohan7 on December 18, 2012 at 10:26 am
    Reply

    Urk. Pardon me, that was a temporary blankness i got on 77. I think all those people were real, and are probably dead with the probable exception of Richard Guadagno.
    And at least some of the Pentagon Dead were real.
    I been having trouble sensing some things the last week or so.

  10. 16
    Colin Doran on December 23, 2012 at 12:09 pm
    Reply

    Hello Kate,
    looking at that video of General Stubblebine , do you really think the things he says make sense? I find it bizarre that someone who had a job in military intelligence could show such an inability first of all to find out the actual facts about the thing he is talking about and then to make a rational assessment even of the facts he does have. It’s painful to watch. I think he has been mislead by distorted misrepresentations of the evidence and the surprising thing is how easily he has been mislead. You appear to think what he says is credible and I think putting up this video , if it convinces anyone else is just misleading them as well. You surely don’t intend to mislead people reading this blog..

    • 17
      Richard Brinkman on December 29, 2012 at 8:02 am
      Reply

      I think I can defend Kate’s news story – She simply turned on the camera and asked the questions that needed to be asked- General Stubblebine gave his opinion. Now it’s we as consumers of information who must take responsibility ourselves to decern Stubblebines words. Not expect Kate to do it for us. It is certainly painful to watch for many and I give credit to Kate’s non aggressive approach presenting this story. Colin, it’s up to you to decide if Stubblebine (Not Kate) is misleading us…

      • 18
        Colin Doran on December 30, 2012 at 7:54 am

        I owe Kate a reply on this issue but can I ask you as someone who seems to be involved in the truth movement and presumably is well informed about the things that General Stubblebine is talking about ,do you think he is accurately presenting the evidence about the event and that his conclusions, based on that evidence, are therefore credible conclusions? I listened to that interview and , because he is so obviously sincere about what he is saying, it is obvious he has been totally mislead about the facts. There is hardly a thing he says that is accurate or factual. Do you think he wants to spread misleading information, or to be basing his conclusions on inaccurate information?

      • 19
        Richard Brinkman on December 30, 2012 at 10:47 am

        In my opinion I believe the General has earned his credibility from years of service to his country, so I already have respect for him, and would consider his opinions on 9/11. Is he accurate with his take on 9/11? Possibly, maybe not entirely or not at all as you might say Colin. I don’t think he believes he’s wrong from what he understands and knows about the Pentagon and the towers on 9/11 and I don’t think he is going out of his way at spreading misleading information.

        As a 9/11 civil information activist of 6 years I would think both the General and I would agree that the official 9/11 story for the most part is inaccurate and misleading. Both corporate media and George W. Bush’s 9/11 commission are responsible for that in my opinion.

        I would think both the General and I might agree that an independent public investigation of 9/11 ought to be forthcoming – but most likely will never happen … at least not in the USA.

        In my opinion “The Toronto Hearings” (CANADA) of September 2011 is the best we have to understand what happened on 9/11 2001. Those hearings covered the towers and the evidence of controlled demolition. The pentagon and the evidence of foul play regarding the Pentagon is highly suspect and warrants a proper investigation too.

  11. 20
    Richard Brinkman on December 28, 2012 at 10:45 pm
    Reply

    Thanks for publishing this interview – now posted on “Edmonton 9/11 Truth Archives”

    • 21
      Colin Doran on December 30, 2012 at 11:47 am
      Reply

      Richard,
      someone who shows an inability to just get the facts straight about what he is talking about just undermines his own credibility in my view. How someone who was actually in charge of intelligence gathering at any level could fail so clearly to just do the basics of intelligence gathering is quite amazing. I’ve heard him do other interviews where he outlines how he goes about intelligence gathering and says that they always rely not on one piece of evidence but on multiple pieces of evidence, and then says that he has studied photos of the Pentagon and concludes that a plane did not hit the building.There are literally dozens and dozens of people who were at the Pentagon and they say they saw the plane crashing into the building. There were hundreds of people who went into the building afterwards to remove debris and bodies of victims and to conduct the identification of bodies. He doesn’t even mention them. It’s as if they don’t exist.. So much for the idea of relying on multiple pieces of evidence.
      On the Toronto Hearings , the stated aim of that event was to put forward evidence against the ‘official story’. If that isn’t a self-fulfilling prophesy I don’t know what is. It’s like a prosecutor in some criminal case holding hearings where he presents all the prosecution evidence unchallenged, without even the preception that there might be a defence case or that the prosecution case, as in a court of law has to be challenged and cross-examined. And they called various witnesses to give evidence, with David Ray Griffin and Barbara Honegger as witnesses to what happened at the Pentagon. They could have actually gone to the US and invited literally dozens of people who were actually witnesses to what actually happened at the Pentagon because they were actually there when it happened and saw it happen but they invite David Ray Griffin and Barbara Honegger, two people who were not there. They did consider inviting April Gallop though. Why her? -because she said that while she was struggling out of the building in the dark and the smoke and chaos she didn’t recognise parts of a plane that she wasn’t looking for. They could have invited dozens of witnesses who would tell them they saw the plane crashing into the building but they seemingly didn’t want to hear their evidence.
      If I sound angry about this then I am angry because I hate to see eveidence being distorted and misrepresented for what ever reason, especially when it’s supposed to be in the interests of ‘truth’. The interests of truth can only be served by truth and by honest assessment of the facts..

      • 22
        Richard Brinkman on December 30, 2012 at 12:26 pm

        “I hate to see evidence being distorted and misrepresented”

        That’s cool and I agree with that. I too am not happy with the 911 commission and Corporate media’s official story.that seems distorted and grossly misrepresented too – I want to see a proper investigation. Remember Colin, we are not in a court here – The General has offered his opinions and I’m glad he did. No one is on trial here. Only a forum that Kate has given opportunity to respond to her story on the General and his opinions. Thanks for your opinion too Colin.

  12. 23
    Elaine Lutz on December 31, 2012 at 8:51 am
    Reply

    On the afternoon of September 11, 2001, I stood outside and looked at the sky with no airplane traffic. I turned to my friend and said “The government did it. If they didn’t do it, they knew it was going to happen, and they let it happen.”
    Every newspaper in the days ahead of the attack were filled with stories about the shit storm enveloping the White House – Bush’s unfavorablity, his incompetence, the stolen 2000 election, on and on. September 11 made it all go away. It was so convenient, for so many, the perfect distraction with the perfect enemy to unite the country.
    What is the truth? We may never know. But as the General points out, there are a lot of dots with very interesting bits of information that raise lots of interesting questions that the government has never fully addressed. I don’t think they will ever go away.

    • 24
      Richard Brinkman on January 5, 2013 at 5:17 am
      Reply

      I became a 9/11 activist in the winter of 2007 around the time the organization “911truth.org” hired Zogby polls to conduct a survey that soon claimed that 1 in 5 Americans had doubts about the official 911 story. In the fall of 2009 news program CBC “The Fifth Estate” in Canada ( Like your CBS 60 minutes in the U.S,) claimed 1 in 3 Canadian had doubt about the official 9/11 story and is was also growing in doubt with folks in New York City.

      In 2011 I personally collected over 900 signatures in my home town Edmonton, in Alberta Canada calling on the Canadian Government to investigate 9/11 and the 24 Canadians who were murdered that terrible. Over the course of 10 months I talked one on one with over 2000 people, mostly around the Universities and by the farmer’s markets in Edmonton. After mailing my petitions to Ottawa September 2011 I realized that if a poll was conducted today we could very well see one in two Canadians doubting the official 9/11 story – so indeed I agree Elaine with your comments, especially the last line ” I don’t think they will ever go away.”

      Thanks for posting!

  13. 25
    frankie on February 4, 2013 at 5:03 am
    Reply

    What it is an hidden power that is goin to come to out soon and china aware of this power.i can not say who or what it is but.. anonymous… is some what on to this and watching closely..the interesting thing is they look like us talk like us act like you and me but form difdifferent countries..they’re very quiet secretive very very wealthy..war type of people with higher needs they want…gold oil coal and more Wallstreet.

  14. 26
    Bestearth on March 2, 2013 at 11:53 pm
    Reply

    Any person who understands what material can do and what it can’t knows that 911 required huge orchestration to pull off. To say that the general doesn’t know what he’s talking about is like saying no one’s allowed to think. It’s diabolical when you consider the logistics of placing charges in 3 buldings with hardly anyone noticing and also distracting the airforce so they couldn’t intercept the planes. The only thing I can think of if your really interested in the truth watch Killuminati, the first section’s about 911.

    I have found that the truth is not liberating at all,not initially. It’s quite burdening and alarming. It destroys the things that need to be destroyed, like trust, naevity, gullibility, innocence, ignorance.

    When you lose these you know you are growing up in the universe. I think part of our mission is to learn how to defeat evil and try and stay centred and balanced while doing so. And not ever forgetting that we have a soul that is eternal. Maybe freedom lies in knowing that you can’t live without your highest values anyway. Mine are Knowledge, Truth and Understanding..

    Cheers,

  15. 27
    stopthebullshit on March 8, 2013 at 5:17 am
    Reply

    Wow. This is so ridiculous that it must be sarcasm. Other wise you guys are totally messed up in the head. Proof by the general! No one died at 911? i had a fucking friend die dumb ass.Have you guys ever heard of facts, critical thinking or research? We are fucked as a nation and planet if people keep on believing in this crap. There are drugs that help with paranoid schizophrenics you know.

  16. 28
    Bestearth on March 8, 2013 at 12:03 pm
    Reply

    Shill patrol 101.
    Citizen says ” I am John Smith”
    Shill says, ” No your not”

    A shill is a person who is paid to debunk truth. They usually work from a dingy office are paid by goverments, they are desparate to take that job, they have no opinions on anything that are their own. They are taught to go on ‘meme patrol,’ to blogs and forums like this one and post stock standard debunks like the one above.

    Recently one of them came out and posted his story called “confessions of a paid shill”, it can be read here,

    http://consciouslifenews.com/paid-internet-shill-shadowy-groups-manipulate-internet-opinion-debate/1147073/

    • 29
      Dcembre on March 23, 2013 at 1:57 am
      Reply

      I agree with you about the comment by stopthebullshit… He’s the bulshitter.

      But what is annoying about this General is that he wakes-up at this age! Even his wife, apparently, woke-up before him… that is amazing to me.
      Can you work in the army and not see the bullies, the fight for a better post, the heavy bureaucracy, the rapes, the torture or is it that in his time, those things didn’t happened?
      If that guy is telling the truth now but was unable to stand-up for the sometimes inhuman army procedures… has he says… there’s something wrong!

      Although we all know that what he said is true 9/11 was a fake, an inside job that served a purpose. Make money and more control over the population.

      Patriot Act, NDAA, indefinite detention are the result of the 9/11 attack.
      Can it get worst for a society who run schools like prisons ?

      • 30
        discerningkate on March 23, 2013 at 4:03 am

        I think peoples’ awakenings are as unique as their finger print. We simply cannot judge their realisations to our standards, otherwise everybody would be awake! It’s not important when, all that matters is that it happens!

  17. 31
    Elle on March 23, 2013 at 3:51 am
    Reply

    Hey Kate:

    Excellent interview with the Major General. So hard to see him recount that his America, our America is no longer under the control of it’s citizens. I’ve long thought that the current military/industrial complex, led by murderers like Cheney are simply waiting for the Boomer generation to die out while plying the last two generations with apathy conditioning furthered by overwork, worry and distress. I’m barely part of the Boomer generation at 60. My old friends are biting the dust almost daily. The Boomers were not a generation to mess with when it came to human rights. The last two have not stepped up to the plate as a group to protect themselves and their children. Individuals, such as yourself, are willing to put themselves on the line and have done so. Unfortunately, you are few and far between. I can only hope that you gather strength, wake-up the rest and “see” because the situation is not getting better. The signs are all around us. Dot,.. dot,.. dot…

    Good work. Keep it coming.

    • 32
      discerningkate on March 23, 2013 at 4:07 am
      Reply

      Hello and thank you! Yes progress seems very slow, I agree but I have faith. Did you read my article called Why the Minority Actually Rules? That should explain why. Just waiting for the tipping point, when we reach 10% of an awakened population. And we can all do our part. Voicing your opinions especially to those who are unawakened can do wonders!

      • 33
        Elle on April 10, 2013 at 6:57 am

        No. But I will.

  18. 34
    ananth lebur on April 1, 2013 at 9:12 pm
    Reply

    In every country such things are happening…..Americans realized because of the magnanimity of the incident…..the magnanimity of Drug wars… Salvador… Nicaragua……did not draw their attention because they happened out side their country…….and now their politicians did it on the home ground………anyway what can you do……now i don’t think you are equipped to do anything about ti !……but one thing you can do is you can expose to the world what an corrupt politician can do…..and high handedness of enforcement agencies………..

  19. 35
    Cellar on April 22, 2013 at 11:45 pm
    Reply

    I can see where the general is coming from when he’s wondering what the US government won’t do to its own citizens. But I still have to question his judgement, to wit: This is a government with a long history of “rogue” operations, weaponising insurgents only to see them turn back on them (repeatedly), waging war on everyone and everything including abstract concepts, and trying to weaponise
    just about everything no matter how esotheric — he should know this

    Given such a government, and in fact a government that already has turned on its own citizens (there is strong evidence for, say, completely irresponsible medical tests often with deadly results, and so on), what grounds are there to suppose it wouldn’t, again and again?

    I say it’s more a case of needing to believe than that there is evidence to support such a belief. This is also why people won’t believe or even won’t want to see the evidence, for it would make them feel unsafe in their mighty country.

    But really now, where is the justification for that belief?

    • 36
      discerningkate on May 9, 2013 at 11:56 pm
      Reply

      The justification comes in the awareness of the options available to us. PROUT (Progressive Utilization Theory) is one such alternative socio-economic system based on spiritual philosophy. You can watch my video interview on this. People will be more inclined to believe the government is the enemy if they feel safe knowing they can do something to change it. It’s about empowering the citizens to make change whilst educating them. Thanks🙂

  20. 37
    authorthat on July 4, 2013 at 8:08 am
    Reply

    The executive in charge of the security for the twin towers was Jeb Bush. THe man running the US for the NWDis O is Bush senior. Those who did the prep work were US black ops specialists assisted by Israeli Mossad agents. The entire military industrial complex was well prepared for the rebuilding of the nations attacked as a result of this false flag. After all, the neocons had the receipt of the weapons of mass destruction, which were chemicals sold to them by the USA in the first place. It’s those chemicals that they hoped to find with the UN inspection team. Aparently a lot was already used up against the Kurdish people in the mountains by Saddam H. If you want to learn about the next big event to unfold, the research has already been done. The United States will be split by a 50 mile wide river, and a port will be built at Salt Lake City Utah. How appropriately named….eh? The work of srtting this up is near complete. All that is to happen is for Obama whio is the false prophet as mentioned in the bible, to ratify the false peace treaty to partition Israel. This marks the countdown to the angelic race of God, begining to mark his own foe 1,260 days.

    • 38
      discerningkate on July 15, 2013 at 2:56 pm
      Reply

      Biblically what do you believe will happen? Are there options?

  21. 39
    Mark on February 22, 2016 at 2:41 am
    Reply

    Hello Kate
    The only way to prove the truth will be to recreate the Pentagon attack in a deserted location and compare the effects .Only then you can really understand what happened that day in Washington DC.
    Best regards
    Mark

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